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[GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Overlong Analysis Cobalt on Sat Oct 20, 2012 1:12 am

Caoimhe wrote:I don't care how far behind I am on this, but this is the most embarrassing thing I've ever sat through.
Well, having watched the first 26 seconds, I can definitely say that I have seen worse! On the other hand, I stopped after 26 seconds and it's 20 minutes long. So there's that. And I wanted to stop after the rabbit's blinking was so... whatever you call it when it's too smooth and lacking in acceleration. The word I'm looking for may be "godawful." Seriously, though, it is a bit sad to see; from those 26 seconds, I got the impression that the project had very high hopes and a great deal of work put into it, but that there was a dearth of people who actually knew what they were doing on the team. And animation just isn't something you can wing and hope for decent results, as far as I know.

@Mel
"Well, what about ABRAHAM LINCOLN, eh? A pony who not only freed slaves but waged war against vampire ponies, as depicted by Stalliongrad's finest documentarian,Tamermane Slomopony. Clearly, a good pony." But, in all seriousness, I'd probably not even try at that point... for one thing, if I was in Blackjack's situation, I would probably not be in a place where changing Boing's mind would be realistically possible... I could pseudo-logically show that, in order for scummy ponies to exist, there must be non-scummy somethings out there, and then draw correlation between those non-scummy things and certain ponies such as Priest, but that is a far cry from actually convincing anypony of anything. I mean, for one thing, that's pretty much just a trick of syntax, and doesn't address the emotional core of her worldview in the slightest. And I don't think anypony has the emotional connection needed to reach her there. That's my take, anyway; someone else might have a solution, or think about it differently.

@OneMoreDaySK
Thanks! I looked up what that meant on Wikipedia, and my reaction was initially: "Psh, naw, that ain't me!" ... and then changed to: "asdsnhytsearfgedzfx yeah that's often me." Especially with regards to the arguing thing. Blargh.

EDIT: Also I need to stop somehow getting first-on-a-pages when I have nothing in particular to say.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by tylertoon2 on Sat Oct 20, 2012 1:16 am

Meleagridis wrote:Open question to the PHCC:

How would you have replied to Boing's nihilistic speech?

As a completely seperate question, how would you try and convince her otherwise?

The Speech:
“Yup. Ploughed good,” she said quietly, simply. “Wasn’t the first time, neither. First time was Daddy makin’ a mare out o’ me while Momma stood by. Reapers got him good. Momma tried sellin’ us to the Society, but I wouldn’t sign so she just dumped me. Ended up in Chapel.” I swallowed in horror. “After we split with you… well, lost Friskyhorn two days later to an angry radhog. Giblets got too many rads, puked up her guts, and never woke up. The others run off. I met those two with a plan to scav some bunker; figured why not? Make enough caps to get out of here. Probably planned on killing me once we found something worthwhile.” She swallowed and closed her eyes. “Then you smashed me good. Doc said you damn near killed me.”
“I’m so sorry…” I muttered.
“And that’s why yer stupid,” the filly countered. “You think my daddy was sorry? Or my momma? Or them raiders? Them ghouls? Was the radhog sorry? Or the radiation?” She gave a little snort and closed her eyes. “Not a one of them was sorry. So why are you coming here askin’ me to forgive you? What’s the point of that?”
“Because… because I am sorry. What I did to you was wrong. I shouldn’t have done it,” I said as I sniffed. “I’m trying to be a good pony… I’m trying to do better…”
“And that’s where you done fucked up. There ain’t no such thing as good ponies. Not a one in the world. I ain’t a good pony. You ain’t neither. We’re all just ponies,” she said as she sighed and closed her eye again, shaking her head. “You just want ta feel better than the rest of us by playing the big hero. Well, ya ain’t. So if you feel like scum, congratulations. You are. And someday you’ll accept that. Then you won’t give a fuck about forgiveness.”

Probably cry. Not gonna lie. And then shut down for a bit later. Maybe try hugs? I don't know what to do, other than this person will not listen to me, because they are just so fucked up in order to remain sane they can't.

@MBTI Pinkie Pie or Scoots.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by swicked on Sat Oct 20, 2012 4:06 am

Meleagridis wrote:Open question to the PHCC:

How would you have replied to Boing's nihilistic speech?

As a completely seperate question, how would you try and convince her otherwise?

The Speech:
“Yup. Ploughed good,” she said quietly, simply. “Wasn’t the first time, neither. First time was Daddy makin’ a mare out o’ me while Momma stood by. Reapers got him good. Momma tried sellin’ us to the Society, but I wouldn’t sign so she just dumped me. Ended up in Chapel.” I swallowed in horror. “After we split with you… well, lost Friskyhorn two days later to an angry radhog. Giblets got too many rads, puked up her guts, and never woke up. The others run off. I met those two with a plan to scav some bunker; figured why not? Make enough caps to get out of here. Probably planned on killing me once we found something worthwhile.” She swallowed and closed her eyes. “Then you smashed me good. Doc said you damn near killed me.”
“I’m so sorry…” I muttered.
“And that’s why yer stupid,” the filly countered. “You think my daddy was sorry? Or my momma? Or them raiders? Them ghouls? Was the radhog sorry? Or the radiation?” She gave a little snort and closed her eyes. “Not a one of them was sorry. So why are you coming here askin’ me to forgive you? What’s the point of that?”
“Because… because I am sorry. What I did to you was wrong. I shouldn’t have done it,” I said as I sniffed. “I’m trying to be a good pony… I’m trying to do better…”
“And that’s where you done fucked up. There ain’t no such thing as good ponies. Not a one in the world. I ain’t a good pony. You ain’t neither. We’re all just ponies,” she said as she sighed and closed her eye again, shaking her head. “You just want ta feel better than the rest of us by playing the big hero. Well, ya ain’t. So if you feel like scum, congratulations. You are. And someday you’ll accept that. Then you won’t give a fuck about forgiveness.”
...convince her otherwise? By, what, lying to her? We are all just people and, in the end, we do what we do because it's just what we do, to put it succinctly. No one is all bad, no one is all good, and moral relatives are always a murky business, anyway.
In all honesty, you could strive to do good your entire life, donating to charity, helping the sick and poor, whatever... then suddenly, one day, decide to run over a child in the street. You wouldn't suddenly be someone else at that point, even if you decided to continue doing that as often as you could until someone stopped you. You'd still just be a person, doing whatever it is you choose to do from one moment to the next.
The best I could say was that she was too young to have come to that conclusion, but she was already on death's door in a world that grants only very short lifespans, so I could hardly fault her for it.

I mean, in the end, she took her philosophy and still tried to live a decent life with allies, maybe even friends, just trying to scrape by. She didn't try to prey on anyone.
I think I just would have sat with her for a while, talking about stuff that was important to me, and trying to learn what things in her life were important to her, or brought her joy. Maybe I could point her in a direction, like the efforts to rebuild chapel, and convince her there are things worth striving for whether or not they "proved" you were nice or worthwhile. Nothing of what you have done all that rigidly defines what you will do, so... yeah.

In any case, for as long as I could, I'd just sit and talk with her and see where the conversation went, as opposed to considering my work done and trotting off figuring that, since I was forgiven, everything must be alright, now.

These sorts of conversations aren't the types of things you can really plan out, though.

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by OBS.GS.§S on Sat Oct 20, 2012 7:01 am

Spoiler:
swicked wrote:
Meleagridis wrote:Open question to the PHCC:

How would you have replied to Boing's nihilistic speech?

As a completely seperate question, how would you try and convince her otherwise?

The Speech:
“Yup. Ploughed good,” she said quietly, simply. “Wasn’t the first time, neither. First time was Daddy makin’ a mare out o’ me while Momma stood by. Reapers got him good. Momma tried sellin’ us to the Society, but I wouldn’t sign so she just dumped me. Ended up in Chapel.” I swallowed in horror. “After we split with you… well, lost Friskyhorn two days later to an angry radhog. Giblets got too many rads, puked up her guts, and never woke up. The others run off. I met those two with a plan to scav some bunker; figured why not? Make enough caps to get out of here. Probably planned on killing me once we found something worthwhile.” She swallowed and closed her eyes. “Then you smashed me good. Doc said you damn near killed me.”
“I’m so sorry…” I muttered.
“And that’s why yer stupid,” the filly countered. “You think my daddy was sorry? Or my momma? Or them raiders? Them ghouls? Was the radhog sorry? Or the radiation?” She gave a little snort and closed her eyes. “Not a one of them was sorry. So why are you coming here askin’ me to forgive you? What’s the point of that?”
“Because… because I am sorry. What I did to you was wrong. I shouldn’t have done it,” I said as I sniffed. “I’m trying to be a good pony… I’m trying to do better…”
“And that’s where you done fucked up. There ain’t no such thing as good ponies. Not a one in the world. I ain’t a good pony. You ain’t neither. We’re all just ponies,” she said as she sighed and closed her eye again, shaking her head. “You just want ta feel better than the rest of us by playing the big hero. Well, ya ain’t. So if you feel like scum, congratulations. You are. And someday you’ll accept that. Then you won’t give a fuck about forgiveness.”
...convince her otherwise? By, what, lying to her? We are all just people and, in the end, we do what we do because it's just what we do, to put it succinctly. No one is all bad, no one is all good, and moral relatives are always a murky business, anyway.
In all honesty, you could strive to do good your entire life, donating to charity, helping the sick and poor, whatever... then suddenly, one day, decide to run over a child in the street. You wouldn't suddenly be someone else at that point, even if you decided to continue doing that as often as you could until someone stopped you. You'd still just be a person, doing whatever it is you choose to do from one moment to the next.
The best I could say was that she was too young to have come to that conclusion, but she was already on death's door in a world that grants only very short lifespans, so I could hardly fault her for it.

I mean, in the end, she took her philosophy and still tried to live a decent life with allies, maybe even friends, just trying to scrape by. She didn't try to prey on anyone.
I think I just would have sat with her for a while, talking about stuff that was important to me, and trying to learn what things in her life were important to her, or brought her joy. Maybe I could point her in a direction, like the efforts to rebuild chapel, and convince her there are things worth striving for whether or not they "proved" you were nice or worthwhile. Nothing of what you have done all that rigidly defines what you will do, so... yeah.

In any case, for as long as I could, I'd just sit and talk with her and see where the conversation went, as opposed to considering my work done and trotting off figuring that, since I was forgiven, everything must be alright, now.

These sorts of conversations aren't the types of things you can really plan out, though.
That was very well thought out and well said Swicked. One thing though, the core of Boing's beliefs seems to be that everything everyone does is for selfish reasons whether those reason be physical gain or mental satisfaction and that nopony can give freely of themselves. Maybe you could try telling her about the sacrifices ponies, even possibly herself, have made in the past for others with no way of being or feeling better for it afterwards.

I think she might interested to hear about certain golden colored pony who lived roughly 200 years ago, from one perspective he would seem like a perfect example of what she's talking about, somepony who did horrible, torturous things and justified them by the goal of ending the war and thus feeling like a hero (and better than everyone else) for it. But if you think about it, would he really have gone through what he did and suffered like he did just to feel superior? His conscience was so mutilated it defied the word guilt, I don't think anypony could feel that way with a mental burden like that on their shoulders, I think he really wanted for the war to simply stop, not for his own happiness and inner peace (which he made sure he could never achieve), but for the sake of everypony, and zebra, and griffin, and dragon out there who deserved better than the world they currently lived in. He accepted being vilified by all including himself for that purpose, and perhaps if the way I'm thinking is true, could be the perfect counter-example to Boing's ideology.

On the other hand I could be full of crap.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Cptadder on Sat Oct 20, 2012 9:21 am

OneMoreDaySK wrote:

@CaptainAdder
Wait, I thought you wanted me to provide you with an avatar, not use one. You never said that!
You... will... get an avatar, the only question is when, not if.
It is.... inevitable
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by OneMoreDaySK on Sat Oct 20, 2012 10:30 am

Cptadder wrote:
OneMoreDaySK wrote:

@CaptainAdder
Wait, I thought you wanted me to provide you with an avatar, not use one. You never said that!
You... will... get an avatar, the only question is when, not if.
It is.... inevitable

I'm just waiting for that one special one that will show up in my life. Trololol

swicked wrote:
Spoiler:
Meleagridis wrote:Open question to the PHCC:

How would you have replied to Boing's nihilistic speech?

As a completely seperate question, how would you try and convince her otherwise?

The
Speech:
“Yup. Ploughed good,” she said quietly, simply. “Wasn’t the
first time, neither. First time was Daddy makin’ a mare out o’ me while
Momma stood by. Reapers got him good. Momma tried sellin’ us to the
Society, but I wouldn’t sign so she just dumped me. Ended up in
Chapel.” I swallowed in horror. “After we split with you… well, lost
Friskyhorn two days later to an angry radhog. Giblets got too many
rads, puked up her guts, and never woke up. The others run off. I met
those two with a plan to scav some bunker; figured why not? Make enough
caps to get out of here. Probably planned on killing me once we found
something worthwhile.” She swallowed and closed her eyes. “Then you
smashed me good. Doc said you damn near killed me.”
“I’m so sorry…” I muttered.
“And
that’s why yer stupid,” the filly countered. “You think my daddy was
sorry? Or my momma? Or them raiders? Them ghouls? Was the radhog
sorry? Or the radiation?” She gave a little snort and closed her eyes.
“Not a one of them was sorry. So why are you coming here askin’ me to
forgive you? What’s the point of that?”
“Because… because I am
sorry. What I did to you was wrong. I shouldn’t have done it,” I said
as I sniffed. “I’m trying to be a good pony… I’m trying to do better…”
“And
that’s where you done fucked up. There ain’t no such thing as good
ponies. Not a one in the world. I ain’t a good pony. You ain’t
neither. We’re all just ponies,” she said as she sighed and closed her
eye again, shaking her head. “You just want ta feel better than the
rest of us by playing the big hero. Well, ya ain’t. So if you feel
like scum, congratulations. You are. And someday you’ll accept that.
Then you won’t give a fuck about forgiveness.”
...convince
her otherwise? By, what, lying to her? We are all just people and, in
the end, we do what we do because it's just what we do, to put it
succinctly. No one is all bad, no one is all good, and moral relatives
are always a murky business, anyway.
In all honesty, you could strive
to do good your entire life, donating to charity, helping the sick and
poor, whatever... then suddenly, one day, decide to run over a child in
the street. You wouldn't suddenly be someone else at that point, even if
you decided to continue doing that as often as you could until someone
stopped you. You'd still just be a person, doing whatever it is you
choose to do from one moment to the next.
The best I could say was
that she was too young to have come to that conclusion, but she was
already on death's door in a world that grants only very short
lifespans, so I could hardly fault her for it.

I mean, in the
end, she took her philosophy and still tried to live a decent life with
allies, maybe even friends, just trying to scrape by. She didn't try to
prey on anyone.
I think I just would have sat with her for a while,
talking about stuff that was important to me, and trying to learn what
things in her life were important to her, or brought her joy. Maybe I
could point her in a direction, like the efforts to rebuild chapel, and
convince her there are things worth striving for whether or not they
"proved" you were nice or worthwhile. Nothing of what you have done all
that rigidly defines what you will do, so... yeah.

In any case,
for as long as I could, I'd just sit and talk with her and see where the
conversation went, as opposed to considering my work done and trotting
off figuring that, since I was forgiven, everything must be alright,
now.

These sorts of conversations aren't the types of things you can really plan out, though.

So
it's pretty much bringing up a minor point in the original, where
Littlepip just saves people and moves on. Can't remember exactly where,
but it was that time where she saved a pony, only for her to get caught
by the mad manticore scientist. At this point you pretty much covered my
opinions. At the end of the day it's you yourself who decides what is
good and what's worth saving in the world. Boing at this point lost
everyone she ever cared for. Forcing ideology on her is just stupid, and
lying to her face is just proving her point of self-justification.
Chapel is probably the best place to see how, yes, they can screw up,
but they value the community and put aside their differences to try and
make it a better place. Otherwise it would turn out like Flank.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Kippershy on Sat Oct 20, 2012 11:17 am

The Goddess was the one to question LP directly over her antics when they first met.

She was telling LP of the corrupt nature of her adventures - though she would go and save ponies from the momentary danger, she wouldn't give them a long lasting chance at having anything better than waiting for the next time the same happened.

Which is true, even if it isn't LP's responsibility to play babysitter.
She can't make sure everyone continues to live a long fulfilling life free of risks, though she doesn't try very hard past getting them out of whatever snag they're in.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by swicked on Sat Oct 20, 2012 11:23 am

OBS.GS.§S wrote:
Spoiler:
swicked wrote:
Meleagridis wrote:Open question to the PHCC:

How would you have replied to Boing's nihilistic speech?

As a completely seperate question, how would you try and convince her otherwise?

The Speech:
“Yup. Ploughed good,” she said quietly, simply. “Wasn’t the first time, neither. First time was Daddy makin’ a mare out o’ me while Momma stood by. Reapers got him good. Momma tried sellin’ us to the Society, but I wouldn’t sign so she just dumped me. Ended up in Chapel.” I swallowed in horror. “After we split with you… well, lost Friskyhorn two days later to an angry radhog. Giblets got too many rads, puked up her guts, and never woke up. The others run off. I met those two with a plan to scav some bunker; figured why not? Make enough caps to get out of here. Probably planned on killing me once we found something worthwhile.” She swallowed and closed her eyes. “Then you smashed me good. Doc said you damn near killed me.”
“I’m so sorry…” I muttered.
“And that’s why yer stupid,” the filly countered. “You think my daddy was sorry? Or my momma? Or them raiders? Them ghouls? Was the radhog sorry? Or the radiation?” She gave a little snort and closed her eyes. “Not a one of them was sorry. So why are you coming here askin’ me to forgive you? What’s the point of that?”
“Because… because I am sorry. What I did to you was wrong. I shouldn’t have done it,” I said as I sniffed. “I’m trying to be a good pony… I’m trying to do better…”
“And that’s where you done fucked up. There ain’t no such thing as good ponies. Not a one in the world. I ain’t a good pony. You ain’t neither. We’re all just ponies,” she said as she sighed and closed her eye again, shaking her head. “You just want ta feel better than the rest of us by playing the big hero. Well, ya ain’t. So if you feel like scum, congratulations. You are. And someday you’ll accept that. Then you won’t give a fuck about forgiveness.”
...convince her otherwise? By, what, lying to her? We are all just people and, in the end, we do what we do because it's just what we do, to put it succinctly. No one is all bad, no one is all good, and moral relatives are always a murky business, anyway.
In all honesty, you could strive to do good your entire life, donating to charity, helping the sick and poor, whatever... then suddenly, one day, decide to run over a child in the street. You wouldn't suddenly be someone else at that point, even if you decided to continue doing that as often as you could until someone stopped you. You'd still just be a person, doing whatever it is you choose to do from one moment to the next.
The best I could say was that she was too young to have come to that conclusion, but she was already on death's door in a world that grants only very short lifespans, so I could hardly fault her for it.

I mean, in the end, she took her philosophy and still tried to live a decent life with allies, maybe even friends, just trying to scrape by. She didn't try to prey on anyone.
I think I just would have sat with her for a while, talking about stuff that was important to me, and trying to learn what things in her life were important to her, or brought her joy. Maybe I could point her in a direction, like the efforts to rebuild chapel, and convince her there are things worth striving for whether or not they "proved" you were nice or worthwhile. Nothing of what you have done all that rigidly defines what you will do, so... yeah.

In any case, for as long as I could, I'd just sit and talk with her and see where the conversation went, as opposed to considering my work done and trotting off figuring that, since I was forgiven, everything must be alright, now.

These sorts of conversations aren't the types of things you can really plan out, though.
That was very well thought out and well said Swicked. One thing though, the core of Boing's beliefs seems to be that everything everyone does is for selfish reasons whether those reason be physical gain or mental satisfaction and that nopony can give freely of themselves. Maybe you could try telling her about the sacrifices ponies, even possibly herself, have made in the past for others with no way of being or feeling better for it afterwards.

I think she might interested to hear about certain golden colored pony who lived roughly 200 years ago, from one perspective he would seem like a perfect example of what she's talking about, somepony who did horrible, torturous things and justified them by the goal of ending the war and thus feeling like a hero (and better than everyone else) for it. But if you think about it, would he really have gone through what he did and suffered like he did just to feel superior? His conscience was so mutilated it defied the word guilt, I don't think anypony could feel that way with a mental burden like that on their shoulders, I think he really wanted for the war to simply stop, not for his own happiness and inner peace (which he made sure he could never achieve), but for the sake of everypony, and zebra, and griffin, and dragon out there who deserved better than the world they currently lived in. He accepted being vilified by all including himself for that purpose, and perhaps if the way I'm thinking is true, could be the perfect counter-example to Boing's ideology.

On the other hand I could be full of crap.
The problem with directly contradicting her with examples of ponies that, apparently, weren't just out for themselves is... she would either not believe the stories, or not believe she'd heard the whole truth. There's no way to prove what was going on in another pony's head. She'd probably say as much and that I was deluded to think otherwise.
I would be approaching the entire conversation with her expecting that my convincing her to not think the way she does was in my best interest. Because it'd make me feel good and I, being scum, would likely be willing to lie.
When you're facing that sort of barrier to winning her trust you can't really address a belief like that head-on. Maybe if and when she would be willing to believe me, but I'd rather take it one step at a time and, again, see where the conversation went.

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Cptadder on Sat Oct 20, 2012 2:36 pm

swicked wrote:
OBS.GS.§S wrote:
Spoiler:
swicked wrote:
Meleagridis wrote:Open question to the PHCC:

How would you have replied to Boing's nihilistic speech?

As a completely seperate question, how would you try and convince her otherwise?

The Speech:
“Yup. Ploughed good,” she said quietly, simply. “Wasn’t the first time, neither. First time was Daddy makin’ a mare out o’ me while Momma stood by. Reapers got him good. Momma tried sellin’ us to the Society, but I wouldn’t sign so she just dumped me. Ended up in Chapel.” I swallowed in horror. “After we split with you… well, lost Friskyhorn two days later to an angry radhog. Giblets got too many rads, puked up her guts, and never woke up. The others run off. I met those two with a plan to scav some bunker; figured why not? Make enough caps to get out of here. Probably planned on killing me once we found something worthwhile.” She swallowed and closed her eyes. “Then you smashed me good. Doc said you damn near killed me.”
“I’m so sorry…” I muttered.
“And that’s why yer stupid,” the filly countered. “You think my daddy was sorry? Or my momma? Or them raiders? Them ghouls? Was the radhog sorry? Or the radiation?” She gave a little snort and closed her eyes. “Not a one of them was sorry. So why are you coming here askin’ me to forgive you? What’s the point of that?”
“Because… because I am sorry. What I did to you was wrong. I shouldn’t have done it,” I said as I sniffed. “I’m trying to be a good pony… I’m trying to do better…”
“And that’s where you done fucked up. There ain’t no such thing as good ponies. Not a one in the world. I ain’t a good pony. You ain’t neither. We’re all just ponies,” she said as she sighed and closed her eye again, shaking her head. “You just want ta feel better than the rest of us by playing the big hero. Well, ya ain’t. So if you feel like scum, congratulations. You are. And someday you’ll accept that. Then you won’t give a fuck about forgiveness.”
...convince her otherwise? By, what, lying to her? We are all just people and, in the end, we do what we do because it's just what we do, to put it succinctly. No one is all bad, no one is all good, and moral relatives are always a murky business, anyway.
In all honesty, you could strive to do good your entire life, donating to charity, helping the sick and poor, whatever... then suddenly, one day, decide to run over a child in the street. You wouldn't suddenly be someone else at that point, even if you decided to continue doing that as often as you could until someone stopped you. You'd still just be a person, doing whatever it is you choose to do from one moment to the next.
The best I could say was that she was too young to have come to that conclusion, but she was already on death's door in a world that grants only very short lifespans, so I could hardly fault her for it.

I mean, in the end, she took her philosophy and still tried to live a decent life with allies, maybe even friends, just trying to scrape by. She didn't try to prey on anyone.
I think I just would have sat with her for a while, talking about stuff that was important to me, and trying to learn what things in her life were important to her, or brought her joy. Maybe I could point her in a direction, like the efforts to rebuild chapel, and convince her there are things worth striving for whether or not they "proved" you were nice or worthwhile. Nothing of what you have done all that rigidly defines what you will do, so... yeah.

In any case, for as long as I could, I'd just sit and talk with her and see where the conversation went, as opposed to considering my work done and trotting off figuring that, since I was forgiven, everything must be alright, now.

These sorts of conversations aren't the types of things you can really plan out, though.
That was very well thought out and well said Swicked. One thing though, the core of Boing's beliefs seems to be that everything everyone does is for selfish reasons whether those reason be physical gain or mental satisfaction and that nopony can give freely of themselves. Maybe you could try telling her about the sacrifices ponies, even possibly herself, have made in the past for others with no way of being or feeling better for it afterwards.

I think she might interested to hear about certain golden colored pony who lived roughly 200 years ago, from one perspective he would seem like a perfect example of what she's talking about, somepony who did horrible, torturous things and justified them by the goal of ending the war and thus feeling like a hero (and better than everyone else) for it. But if you think about it, would he really have gone through what he did and suffered like he did just to feel superior? His conscience was so mutilated it defied the word guilt, I don't think anypony could feel that way with a mental burden like that on their shoulders, I think he really wanted for the war to simply stop, not for his own happiness and inner peace (which he made sure he could never achieve), but for the sake of everypony, and zebra, and griffin, and dragon out there who deserved better than the world they currently lived in. He accepted being vilified by all including himself for that purpose, and perhaps if the way I'm thinking is true, could be the perfect counter-example to Boing's ideology.

On the other hand I could be full of crap.
The problem with directly contradicting her with examples of ponies that, apparently, weren't just out for themselves is... she would either not believe the stories, or not believe she'd heard the whole truth. There's no way to prove what was going on in another pony's head. She'd probably say as much and that I was deluded to think otherwise.
I would be approaching the entire conversation with her expecting that my convincing her to not think the way she does was in my best interest. Because it'd make me feel good and I, being scum, would likely be willing to lie.
When you're facing that sort of barrier to winning her trust you can't really address a belief like that head-on. Maybe if and when she would be willing to believe me, but I'd rather take it one step at a time and, again, see where the conversation went.

This thing with Boing has gotten me thinking. The problem with Boing is that she's been in the shit, and by the shit I mean the minute to minute fight for survival you only get in the war zones. As the wasteland is one giant free for all war zone with the added fun of taint and radiation Boing has never known peace. From what it sounds like Boing was never in Chapel long. Just long enough to refit and go back out. She's been fighting her entire life, fighting to survive, fighting for a place for herself. And when she found one in the crusaders and even made a friend she's still ruthless to everyone else. And losing her one friend did nothing to help her doom and gloom thinking. So the best way to counter that? Simple, throw the kitchen sink at her. She has nothing to do but sit and think when she's recovering so you try every method you think will help without it shutting her off your words.

Point to her inexperience, how can she claim such great knowledge? Was she alive for the world that was? Did she hear the soft words of Celestia with her own ears? Did she see harmony when it was at it's strongest? To the world that is, has she heard the dull hum of Fillydelphia and hundreds of thousands of ponies labor, the quiet threat of the whispering wood? Has she traveled Manhattans rails to see Tenpony Tower and the richness and splendor it has. Has the little filly been to sea where the only sound are the waves and the only sight the wide open world and that glorious blue sky? Or have you little filly lived all your life in what all regard as the worst place in the entire wasteland. Hoofington where even streets hate you and all that lives. Where healing potions that have survived two centuries spoil in hours. Where the food taste of nothing but the ashes of the dead. You who have seen nothing of this world are all ready to declare it fundamentally corrupt and empty of all happiness?

She's a little filly, a capable one but ignorant of the wonders and horrors of the world. She needs to open her eyes and stop assuming because she is right, assuming things gets you killed. But that works both ways and she ignores that side of things.


That's how I say it, because the OTHER possibility is that Boing is pre-raider. She was raped repeatably by raiders after all and has been out and surviving on who knows what up until now. In which case arguments are not going to reach her as paranoia is one of the first signs as I recall.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by OneMoreDaySK on Sat Oct 20, 2012 2:48 pm

Cptadder wrote:
Spoiler:
swicked wrote:
OBS.GS.§S wrote:
Spoiler:
swicked wrote:
Meleagridis wrote:Open question to the PHCC:

How would you have replied to Boing's nihilistic speech?

As a completely seperate question, how would you try and convince her otherwise?

The Speech:
“Yup. Ploughed good,” she said quietly, simply. “Wasn’t the first time, neither. First time was Daddy makin’ a mare out o’ me while Momma stood by. Reapers got him good. Momma tried sellin’ us to the Society, but I wouldn’t sign so she just dumped me. Ended up in Chapel.” I swallowed in horror. “After we split with you… well, lost Friskyhorn two days later to an angry radhog. Giblets got too many rads, puked up her guts, and never woke up. The others run off. I met those two with a plan to scav some bunker; figured why not? Make enough caps to get out of here. Probably planned on killing me once we found something worthwhile.” She swallowed and closed her eyes. “Then you smashed me good. Doc said you damn near killed me.”
“I’m so sorry…” I muttered.
“And that’s why yer stupid,” the filly countered. “You think my daddy was sorry? Or my momma? Or them raiders? Them ghouls? Was the radhog sorry? Or the radiation?” She gave a little snort and closed her eyes. “Not a one of them was sorry. So why are you coming here askin’ me to forgive you? What’s the point of that?”
“Because… because I am sorry. What I did to you was wrong. I shouldn’t have done it,” I said as I sniffed. “I’m trying to be a good pony… I’m trying to do better…”
“And that’s where you done fucked up. There ain’t no such thing as good ponies. Not a one in the world. I ain’t a good pony. You ain’t neither. We’re all just ponies,” she said as she sighed and closed her eye again, shaking her head. “You just want ta feel better than the rest of us by playing the big hero. Well, ya ain’t. So if you feel like scum, congratulations. You are. And someday you’ll accept that. Then you won’t give a fuck about forgiveness.”
...convince her otherwise? By, what, lying to her? We are all just people and, in the end, we do what we do because it's just what we do, to put it succinctly. No one is all bad, no one is all good, and moral relatives are always a murky business, anyway.
In all honesty, you could strive to do good your entire life, donating to charity, helping the sick and poor, whatever... then suddenly, one day, decide to run over a child in the street. You wouldn't suddenly be someone else at that point, even if you decided to continue doing that as often as you could until someone stopped you. You'd still just be a person, doing whatever it is you choose to do from one moment to the next.
The best I could say was that she was too young to have come to that conclusion, but she was already on death's door in a world that grants only very short lifespans, so I could hardly fault her for it.

I mean, in the end, she took her philosophy and still tried to live a decent life with allies, maybe even friends, just trying to scrape by. She didn't try to prey on anyone.
I think I just would have sat with her for a while, talking about stuff that was important to me, and trying to learn what things in her life were important to her, or brought her joy. Maybe I could point her in a direction, like the efforts to rebuild chapel, and convince her there are things worth striving for whether or not they "proved" you were nice or worthwhile. Nothing of what you have done all that rigidly defines what you will do, so... yeah.

In any case, for as long as I could, I'd just sit and talk with her and see where the conversation went, as opposed to considering my work done and trotting off figuring that, since I was forgiven, everything must be alright, now.

These sorts of conversations aren't the types of things you can really plan out, though.
That was very well thought out and well said Swicked. One thing though, the core of Boing's beliefs seems to be that everything everyone does is for selfish reasons whether those reason be physical gain or mental satisfaction and that nopony can give freely of themselves. Maybe you could try telling her about the sacrifices ponies, even possibly herself, have made in the past for others with no way of being or feeling better for it afterwards.

I think she might interested to hear about certain golden colored pony who lived roughly 200 years ago, from one perspective he would seem like a perfect example of what she's talking about, somepony who did horrible, torturous things and justified them by the goal of ending the war and thus feeling like a hero (and better than everyone else) for it. But if you think about it, would he really have gone through what he did and suffered like he did just to feel superior? His conscience was so mutilated it defied the word guilt, I don't think anypony could feel that way with a mental burden like that on their shoulders, I think he really wanted for the war to simply stop, not for his own happiness and inner peace (which he made sure he could never achieve), but for the sake of everypony, and zebra, and griffin, and dragon out there who deserved better than the world they currently lived in. He accepted being vilified by all including himself for that purpose, and perhaps if the way I'm thinking is true, could be the perfect counter-example to Boing's ideology.

On the other hand I could be full of crap.
The problem with directly contradicting her with examples of ponies that, apparently, weren't just out for themselves is... she would either not believe the stories, or not believe she'd heard the whole truth. There's no way to prove what was going on in another pony's head. She'd probably say as much and that I was deluded to think otherwise.
I would be approaching the entire conversation with her expecting that my convincing her to not think the way she does was in my best interest. Because it'd make me feel good and I, being scum, would likely be willing to lie.
When you're facing that sort of barrier to winning her trust you can't really address a belief like that head-on. Maybe if and when she would be willing to believe me, but I'd rather take it one step at a time and, again, see where the conversation went.

This thing with Boing has gotten me thinking. The problem with Boing is that she's been in the shit, and by the shit I mean the minute to minute fight for survival you only get in the war zones. As the wasteland is one giant free for all war zone with the added fun of taint and radiation Boing has never known peace. From what it sounds like Boing was never in Chapel long. Just long enough to refit and go back out. She's been fighting her entire life, fighting to survive, fighting for a place for herself. And when she found one in the crusaders and even made a friend she's still ruthless to everyone else. And losing her one friend did nothing to help her doom and gloom thinking. So the best way to counter that? Simple, throw the kitchen sink at her. She has nothing to do but sit and think when she's recovering so you try every method you think will help without it shutting her off your words.

Point to her inexperience, how can she claim such great knowledge? Was she alive for the world that was? Did she hear the soft words of Celestia with her own ears? Did she see harmony when it was at it's strongest? To the world that is, has she heard the dull hum of Fillydelphia and hundreds of thousands of ponies labor, the quiet threat of the whispering wood? Has she traveled Manhattans rails to see Tenpony Tower and the richness and splendor it has. Has the little filly been to sea where the only sound are the waves and the only sight the wide open world and that glorious blue sky? Or have you little filly lived all your life in what all regard as the worst place in the entire wasteland. Hoofington where even streets hate you and all that lives. Where healing potions that have survived two centuries spoil in hours. Where the food taste of nothing but the ashes of the dead. You who have seen nothing of this world are all ready to declare it fundamentally corrupt and empty of all happiness?

She's a little filly, a capable one but ignorant of the wonders and horrors of the world. She needs to open her eyes and stop assuming because she is right, assuming things gets you killed. But that works both ways and she ignores that side of things.


That's how I say it, because the OTHER possibility is that Boing is pre-raider. She was raped repeatably by raiders after all and has been out and surviving on who knows what up until now. In which case arguments are not going to reach her as paranoia is one of the first signs as I recall.

To me, she's kinda in the same hopelessness as Murky right now, except throw in some friends who are still alive. Sure she's not a slave or anything, but is freedom worth the lack of friends. That's exactly what she needs right now I feel. Someone who's willing to help her get back on her feet. Maybe in an alternate timeline methinks Tulip might be able to help with that. but now, not even Blackjack can do that. [silly] OC INTRO GO! FIXER SUE ACTIVATE! [/silly]
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Ketchup on Sat Oct 20, 2012 3:00 pm

OneMoreDaySK wrote:Um. Sorry to bother y'all, but could anyone care to help me out? Ah need some people to take a Myers-Brigg survey for my Comp Sci class to collect data before the stroke of midnight (Professor is dramatic like that). Enter a username, fill out the quiz, and then submit the profile. Thanks in advance. Here's the link.
INTJ, not INFP or INTP like I got last time I took it, about 9 months ago. I am not a judgmental person, not of others anyway.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by swicked on Sat Oct 20, 2012 3:05 pm

...I don't think I see how flat-out yelling at her that everything she knows is wrong is necessarily going to change her mind. Especially if your examples of how she's wrong involve how things were like before the ponies hundreds of years before ruined everything. They had paradise and they were still scum and brought about this horrible reality. Now, after hundreds of years, to the best of her knowledge... nothing has improved. At all.

Maybe, though, with enough memory orbs of beautiful things and happy times, it'd overpower her perception of reality and make her want things to be better despite the feeling that they never could be. That or it'd just make her addicted to watching memory orbs. I'm honestly surprised we haven't found more ponies out in the wasteland peddling memories of paradise out to ponies that, otherwise, don't have any hope left for their world.

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by OBS.GS.§S on Sat Oct 20, 2012 4:37 pm

Spoiler:
swicked wrote:...I don't think I see how flat-out yelling at her that everything she knows is wrong is necessarily going to change her mind. Especially if your examples of how she's wrong involve how things were like before the ponies hundreds of years before ruined everything. They had paradise and they were still scum and brought about this horrible reality. Now, after hundreds of years, to the best of her knowledge... nothing has improved. At all.

Maybe, though, with enough memory orbs of beautiful things and happy times, it'd overpower her perception of reality and make her want things to be better despite the feeling that they never could be. That or it'd just make her addicted to watching memory orbs. I'm honestly surprised we haven't found more ponies out in the wasteland peddling memories of paradise out to ponies that, otherwise, don't have any hope left for their world.
I suppose you're right, she probably either wouldn't believe the stories about ponies in pre-apocalypse equestria, or just point out how the world still blew up anyway. We'd have to gain her trust first somehow before there would even be a possibility of her believing those stories.

As for the memory orb shop idea, that's actually pretty brilliant and now that I think about it I'm surprised we haven't found "Joe Schmoes house of happy dreams" yet. Although I think the reason behind that is that memory orbs, especially ones that both contain a memory and are happy, are very rare, though if I remember correctly, blackjack or somebody bought some blank memory orbs from charity or someone at somepoint (my memory is really foggy on the matter.) and I'm not sure, but I think there was another instance where either she or littlepip bought a memory orb that wasn't empty from a merchant, maybe they both did.

Anyone else ever have the problem of having the events from PH and the original FoE mesh together in their head?
It's rather disorienting.

EDIT: We still haven't found that important detail Hinds said we missed in the chapter, have we?
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Kippershy on Sat Oct 20, 2012 5:47 pm

OBS.GS.§S wrote:
Spoiler:
swicked wrote:...I don't think I see how flat-out yelling at her that everything she knows is wrong is necessarily going to change her mind. Especially if your examples of how she's wrong involve how things were like before the ponies hundreds of years before ruined everything. They had paradise and they were still scum and brought about this horrible reality. Now, after hundreds of years, to the best of her knowledge... nothing has improved. At all.

Maybe, though, with enough memory orbs of beautiful things and happy times, it'd overpower her perception of reality and make her want things to be better despite the feeling that they never could be. That or it'd just make her addicted to watching memory orbs. I'm honestly surprised we haven't found more ponies out in the wasteland peddling memories of paradise out to ponies that, otherwise, don't have any hope left for their world.
I suppose you're right, she probably either wouldn't believe the stories about ponies in pre-apocalypse equestria, or just point out how the world still blew up anyway. We'd have to gain her trust first somehow before there would even be a possibility of her believing those stories.

As for the memory orb shop idea, that's actually pretty brilliant and now that I think about it I'm surprised we haven't found "Joe Schmoes house of happy dreams" yet. Although I think the reason behind that is that memory orbs, especially ones that both contain a memory and are happy, are very rare, though if I remember correctly, blackjack or somebody bought some blank memory orbs from charity or someone at somepoint (my memory is really foggy on the matter.) and I'm not sure, but I think there was another instance where either she or littlepip bought a memory orb that wasn't empty from a merchant, maybe they both did.

Anyone else ever have the problem of having the events from PH and the original FoE mesh together in their head?
It's rather disorienting.

EDIT: We still haven't found that important detail Hinds said we missed in the chapter, have we?


Wow, your memory really is... something.

Yes, Blackjack bought some blank memory orbs from Charity back in chapter 50 so she could go into Rampages mind and take the memories out, put them in orbs and allow her to see the final moments of the zebra inside of her.
(and if her plan continues, each of the other personalities too.)
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by OBS.GS.§S on Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:25 pm

Kippershy wrote:
Spoiler:
OBS.GS.§S wrote:
Spoiler:
swicked wrote:...I don't think I see how flat-out yelling at her that everything she knows is wrong is necessarily going to change her mind. Especially if your examples of how she's wrong involve how things were like before the ponies hundreds of years before ruined everything. They had paradise and they were still scum and brought about this horrible reality. Now, after hundreds of years, to the best of her knowledge... nothing has improved. At all.

Maybe, though, with enough memory orbs of beautiful things and happy times, it'd overpower her perception of reality and make her want things to be better despite the feeling that they never could be. That or it'd just make her addicted to watching memory orbs. I'm honestly surprised we haven't found more ponies out in the wasteland peddling memories of paradise out to ponies that, otherwise, don't have any hope left for their world.
I suppose you're right, she probably either wouldn't believe the stories about ponies in pre-apocalypse equestria, or just point out how the world still blew up anyway. We'd have to gain her trust first somehow before there would even be a possibility of her believing those stories.

As for the memory orb shop idea, that's actually pretty brilliant and now that I think about it I'm surprised we haven't found "Joe Schmoes house of happy dreams" yet. Although I think the reason behind that is that memory orbs, especially ones that both contain a memory and are happy, are very rare, though if I remember correctly, blackjack or somebody bought some blank memory orbs from charity or someone at somepoint (my memory is really foggy on the matter.) and I'm not sure, but I think there was another instance where either she or littlepip bought a memory orb that wasn't empty from a merchant, maybe they both did.

Anyone else ever have the problem of having the events from PH and the original FoE mesh together in their head?
It's rather disorienting.

EDIT: We still haven't found that important detail Hinds said we missed in the chapter, have we?


Wow, your memory really is... something.

Yes, Blackjack bought some blank memory orbs from Charity back in chapter 50 so she could go into Rampages mind and take the memories out, put them in orbs and allow her to see the final moments of the zebra inside of her.
(and if her plan continues, each of the other personalities too.)

I am the smrt S-M-R-T

I may have issues remembering what I've had for breakfast, but I once took an I.Q. test online, and when I was done it said I was really really smart and the site said they would give me a grant for $1000 if I gave them my Name, Age, and Social Security number.

So yea.

Edit: I r Double smrt!


Last edited by OBS.GS.§S on Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by O. Hinds on Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:37 pm

OBS.GS.§S wrote:
EDIT: We still haven't found that important detail Hinds said we missed in the chapter, have we?
Well, someone asked me to point it out in a spoiler, which I did, and then there was some debate over whether my interpretation of the wording is actually the only valid one.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Ironmonger on Sat Oct 20, 2012 11:00 pm

Dear Princess Celestia,

Today I learned that while being out with my friends, the Nerd Herd, migrating across Milford Ohio in search of new grazing grounds for three hours, three miles of walking and humongous twisting hills that I have to climb to get back to my extraction point do not mix.

Blow it out your ass. Or something...or how about you fuck as in off.

Sincerely, the avatar of the Iron God.

PS: None of this is your fault, but I still blame it on you. Because Mexico.

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Admiral Stoic Rum on Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:05 am

Iron sounds like you're being a pansy
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by OneMoreDaySK on Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:07 am

Not everyone can do stuff like that, Rum.
Maybe I could, but I live a sheltered life.
My cousin definitely could. He climbs mountains during the weekends.
He's awesome like that. <a href="http://jt-adventure-art.blogspot.com/">Linky</a>
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Stringtheory on Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:09 am

Ironmonger wrote:Dear Princess Celestia,

Today I learned that while being out with my friends, the Nerd Herd, migrating across Milford Ohio in search of new grazing grounds for three hours, three miles of walking and humongous twisting hills that I have to climb to get back to my extraction point do not mix.

Blow it out your ass. Or something...or how about you fuck as in off.

Sincerely, the avatar of the Iron God.

PS: None of this is your fault, but I still blame it on you. Because Mexico.
um, what?
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Cptadder on Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:13 am

stringtheory wrote:
Ironmonger wrote:Dear Princess Celestia,

Today I learned that while being out with my friends, the Nerd Herd, migrating across Milford Ohio in search of new grazing grounds for three hours, three miles of walking and humongous twisting hills that I have to climb to get back to my extraction point do not mix.

Blow it out your ass. Or something...or how about you fuck as in off.

Sincerely, the avatar of the Iron God.

PS: None of this is your fault, but I still blame it on you. Because Mexico.
um, what?
First off woah, I know exactly where Ironmonger is talking about as I used to live there. In Blue Ash now.
Second Stringtheory he went on a trip, Indian Creek state Park, Stonelick or East Fork, one of the bigger nature preserves and went into the brush for over three miles... then had to turn around and come BACK three miles which sucks.

And he was hoping to avoid the walk back by getting sent to the moon instead, thus the second to last line.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Erumpet on Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:15 am

Only three miles? That's pretty weak sauce, not going to lie here. Even with hills. I have to back Rum on this, it's time for you to cowboy up cupcake.
(Totally kidding, depending on just how hilly it actually was that might be a tough trip. Might be.)
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Admiral Stoic Rum on Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:23 am

Ahh, great to have some back up Erumpet...

Honestly ya baby, if youhad a 90 lb pack with full body armor and weapons load-out then I will hear your complaints and forward them to the trash bin with a sigh of empathy. I doubt you had this, so suck it up. OORA!
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Ketchup on Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:47 am

I went on a hiking trip about 5 or so years ago that was 8 kilometers, and 6 miles is close to ten kilometers, so I have some idea of the length. I probably could barely do it now, and it was a pretty hard hike back then when I was in better shape. The trail involved many hills through a forest, and the scenery was unparalleled at that point in my life with several waterfalls and such.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Kippershy on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:21 am

I'm with Admiral.

I used to walk 3.5 miles just to get to work on the night shift, even on days when it would piss down with rain half way through without warning so no umbrella, up slops and then do a whole night-shift and come back the same route which also had up-hill parts on the way back -- AND all tis while working a 2 nights 3 days week with only one day transition between the swap for a good few months... all without complaining.



That's 7 miles, often in the rain.
Working a night shift alone and being expected to manage what requires 2 people by myself, not getting lunch and still failing.
Little sleep between night / day swaps.
Every day for months.



a three mile each way trip as a once off is fuck all.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Stringtheory on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:34 am

Kippershy wrote:*snip*
um, wow, you actually have a legit 'I had to walk uphill both ways...' story Dash clapping

feel free to use it to belittle us whenever you feel it's necessary
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Kippershy on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:39 am

stringtheory wrote:
Kippershy wrote:*snip*
um, wow, you actually have a legit 'I had to walk uphill both ways...' story

feel free to use it to belittle us whenever you feel it's necessary

Heh, that's the thing. not trying to belittle, but in this case, it needed to be said.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Ketchup on Sun Oct 21, 2012 2:04 am

Mind you, a long hike is not necessarily the same as a long walk. Obstacles and terrain irregularities can make it significantly harder to walk on nature trails and the like when compared to roads.

Though I'm not really one to talk about long distance commutes. My shins become stiff and burn after a 1.4 km fastwalk home from the school I go to. When doing so in the morning they don't do that, so it's probably from the commuting I do at the same pace around the school.
When I'm walking at a leisurely pace, I can walk much farther without this problem.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by O. Hinds on Sun Oct 21, 2012 2:11 am

So, quite a few stories that I've been following on FiMFiction updated, today, and, not having had much else I needed to do, I've read most of the updates. I think, though, that, after a while, my head got so full of words that some of them started spilling back out. So...
More Iffy Writing:
The last of the spooling-down turbojet's whine fell to nothing, leaving only silence and the susurrus of the self-generated wind passing the fuselage of the sky-pointed airplane. Even that was starting to ebb now as the last of my airspeed fell away to the inexorable pull of gravity. It was cold up here, even with the cockpit heater on. It cleared the mind, the cold, hovering just on the edge of being uncomfortable without actually getting there. It was part of the reason I was up here. These flights were, logically, pretty stupid. I ought to be getting rest, in case I was needed, I was making more work for the maintenance people, I was using up cicl (which we still had plenty of, thank goodness)… and I was, of course, indulged anyway. I sometimes wondered if perhaps I was letting my position go too much to my head, but I could afford this one flight, at least. I sighed, closed my eyes, pushed all my worries and planning to the back of my mind, let myself hang back in my seat, and opened my eyes again.

I hung motionless in space on still metal wings, surrounded by silence and an endless, deepest dark filled with distant points of cold fire. Some, when they think of the sky, think of clouds, or blue, or the sun. The blue is but a shroud drawn by the air, and the clouds, sun, moon and even stars merely fellow travelers. The sky was black, infinite and glorious, filled with everything and nothing.

I kept staring, serene and rapturous, as the noise of flowing air, now from tail to nose, began to intrude on the quiet. I'd carefully inspected the spotless canopy myself before this flight, but, as always, I still wanted to open it. I didn't, of course, as always; those who called me the goddess of the sky had no idea what that would truly mean.

The wind was picking up now, and I reluctantly closed my eyes again. With gentle movements of my hooves I turned the backwards vertical fall into a slow and graceful controlled tumble into a nose-first vertical fall, and I didn't open my eyes again until I was halfway through. The softly-glowing moon, formerly and intentionally hidden by the body of the plane, was off to one side now, and the closer, more crowded black of the land, dotted with lights of civilization instead of starfire, was taking up steadily more of my field of view. I looked over at the moon with mixed feelings. Beautiful, in its way… and an enemy. We have never, as a people, much liked the night, and the night sky in particular was thought ill of. Now we fought the one who was supposed to be its goddess, and although that claim was nearly as laughable as saying that I was the deity of the sky, Luna was truly the mare of the moon, and Nightmare Moon, if indeed it was still her, had power granted by stars. Quite a foe, but we fought nonetheless. Myself… Alicorns of the sun and moon and wielders of great magical power besides, they were not opponents I would have chosen, but I would fly against them, literally, if there was need. We could win. That they had not simply struck us down showed that their powers were far less than we had feared (or, as I sometimes thought, that they were just toying with us, but those thoughts were quickly squelched; we would not fail because of me), and we had already done so much that would be believed impossible.

My plummet was nearly fast enough to restart the engine, and, drawing ever closer to the ground, I began the startup sequence. Command hated these flights. The fuel, the time, the work… all valid concerns, to some extent, but the biggest reason was what might happen if they ever stopped being secret. As I said, we have never as a people been too comfortable with the night sky, the stars are seen as enemies, and the moon is a symbol and possession of our more earthly present dangers. Superstition, when roused, usually proves to have never been quite as dead as was thought, and in many places superstitious fear of the night sky was still not even concealed. If it was known that I liked making these flights to look at it, to, in a way, commune with it… I have never demanded anything of the stars, and have no plans of doing something so stupid. I have never asked anything of them, either, and I worship them no more than I worship the Equestrian Princesses.

The turbine spun to life behind me, reached the proper speed, and ignited, but for the moment I kept the plane in a vertical powerdive.

Not that the truth would help morale as much as the perception would hurt it. My feelings for the sky, the true sky, I doubted would be understood, but history, legend, and the popular consciousness all had their thoughts on "worship" of the night sky and its contents. I'd still fly, oh, of course I'd still fly, but as a shameful weapon rather than a hero. We needed everything we could get, and if me being a hero helped… well, and I wasn't going to deny that some of the perks were nice. And one of the benefits of being constantly on one sort of duty or another was that I didn't have to worry about the press that hounded more civilian celebrities.

The plane was starting to shake, signaling, from the feel, that the powerdive was edging me towards the speed of sound. "They" were saying that the next generation was actually going to be designed to operate regularly past the barrier, but even my customized Acinaces wasn't equipped for safe maneuvering in that realm. Besides, the people on the ground didn't need to have their sleep interrupted by a sonic boom. I pulled a moderate-g turn (no need to tax things right now) into a slightly upward trajectory, bleeding off speed until the airplane stopped trembling. The turn also brought the landing strip into view ahead. I contemplated staying aloft for a while longer… but I did need sleep.

And, I thought as I reached a not-quite-stop and began taxiing my scarlet-painted fighter towards the lit hangar and waiting groundcrew, I'd certainly get to fly more later. Perhaps, one of these days, even against Rainbow Dash.
I think that happening to hear this was probably also an influence.


By the way, is no one here interested in that bridge stuff I posted? Or, on the subject of things I've posted that haven't had many responses, that political thing (though Cptadder, at least, did reply to that one)?


PS: Does anyone know what exactly these general download manager things that banner ads keep trying to convince me to get definitely not malware versions of are? I know that specific sites offer download managers for their own content, but every modern browser, as far as I know, can download things just fine by itself. I suspect that they might be entirely fictional, to be honest; it seems sometimes that at least 75% of online ads are at least spam and probably malware, even on good websites.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by OBS.GS.§S on Sun Oct 21, 2012 8:38 am

O. Hinds wrote:*snip*

The safest bet is to never click on ads, ever. Most, if not everything you might want to have software wise can be found through google and sites like Cnet and the like. If you're noticing you don't have access to the same content others do, just post about it and I'm sure someone smarter than me will help you set things straight.

To my experience, ads on the internet are 80% malware, 19.5% poorly designed third rate products, and 0.5% useful things. This is because most legitimate products that work well are able to find their way onto well known sites that specialize in that type of product due to the demand they create, the trash on the other hand, usually winds up on random, unrelated sites that need the money from hosting advertisements to pay the domain hosting fee.

I have no idea what exactly those general download manager things are though since I've never seen the banner ad for them, mainly because I ignore ads in general.
__________

As for the political thing, politics aren't my strong suit and don't really interest me unless it's something that affects a vital aspect of my lifestyle, like SOPA was trying to.
__________

I'm interested in your ideas, I just probably haven't been around when you posted them or I wasn't knowledgeable on the subject to contribute worthwhile feedback. I vaguely remember something about a train idea you had a long time ago, and the reason I didn't comment on it was because I wasn't able to understand what I was looking at due to my lack of knowledge. Also I think that was during the time where I was being overloaded by life and was hopelessly unorganized.

If you want though, I can try to comment on your ideas more often, even if it's just a "That's a neat concept" or "It looks heavy".
__________

Also, I liked that little scene you wrote with the zebra pilot, for constructive criticism I think the line
"I'd carefully inspected the spotless canopy myself before this flight,
but, as always, I still wanted to open it. I didn't, of course, as
always;"
would benefit from cutting the second "as always" as it would still convey the same message and make it flow better, in my opinion. Overall though I got the general idea and mood of the scene, I enjoyed it.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

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