[GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Evilgidgit wrote:Thanks everyone for the welcome. You don't find kindness like this over on the IMDb forums let me tell you.

I finished Chapter 17 last night, and it's kind of been a curiosity of mine what the Dealer's cards symbolise on the second page. I think I have an idea about most of them, but I'm curious about everyone else's views (if symbology is your thing). Here are some of my views:

They're Tarot cards. Here's a basic rundown from Wikipedia:

-A pink mare on a cliff edge balancing on a ball holding a cupcake and a present - Obviously Pinkie teetering on the edge of addiction/insanity

0(or22) the Fool

Wikipedia wrote:In many esoteric systems of interpretation, the Fool is usually interpreted as the protagonist of a story, and the Major Arcana is the path the Fool takes through the great mysteries of life and the main human archetypes. This path is known traditionally in Tarot as the Fool's Journey, and is frequently used to introduce the meaning of Major Arcana cards to beginners

So, this card basically represents Blackjack

-A white alicorn with a pair of scales - Princess Celestia and something to do with the balance of power.

Justice

wiki wrote:
Justice mediates the various claims of right, of morality, of duty. In a world of scarcity, not every claim can be met. Justice, in theory, sets forth a system to judge between the claims. The tarot card is therefore typically closer to the notion of Jurisprudence than to the abstract concept of Justice.

The Justice card is closely connected to The High Priestess through its cross sum (the sum of the digits). Unlike the hidden knowledge of the High Priestess, Justice is decided in the open; we are left hoping that our intellect and our intuition take us to the same place.

Justice is also connected to Judgment, Key 20, the ultimate weighting of souls. In Waite's classic version, to the right are represented the scales (Libra), signifying balance; to the left is the sword, signifying accountability.

Probably represents the responsibility Blackjack must shoulder with EC1101

-A pair of eyes eyes peeking out of a cage made of nine swords - Kind of vague this one, but I'd say something to do with the Marauders (since there are nine members) and the red eyes symbolise the monsters that most of them will become.

The 9 of swords. In occult tarot, swords represent nobility, military, and reason and are associated with air (pegasi?)

Wiki wrote:Terror, the Nightmare. Tarot readers do not generally like to categorise cards as "bad", or "good" but The Nine of Swords is probably the most dreaded card in the deck, however it can indicate the process of letting go, grief, and in combination with healing cards like The Queen of Wands, it is highly beneficial.

So maybe it represents Blackjack finally letting go of her stable?

-An empty Wild Pegasus bottle with eight upturned shot glasses in a bar with a mare in the background - I'd say the foreshadowed destruction of the Marauders caused by Big Macintosh's relationship with Maripony/Twilight.

The eight of cups/chalices
[quote='wikipedia"]Eight cups are arranged in a row. A figure leaves these cups behind as if beginning a journey. An indifferent moon looks down upon the traveler. The traveler is in a good situation where there is much promise and much to offer, but chooses to set out for the unknown. It indicates a restlessness and wanderlust as well as overlooking the good we already possess, in the hopes of finding something else.[/quote]
Dealer trying to tell BJ not to go on this quest because she has it good already (but she knows it could be better).

-A purple mare hanging from a rusty street light by her tail - Twilight's despair over the war and what she goes through.

The Hanged Man

wikipedia wrote:The gallows from which he is suspended forms a Tau cross, while the figure—from the position of the legs—forms a fylfot cross. There is a nimbus about the head of the seeming martyr. It should be noted (1) that the tree of sacrifice is living wood, with leaves thereon; (2) that the face expresses deep entrancement, not suffering; (3) that the figure, as a whole, suggests life in suspension, but life and not death. [...] It has been called falsely a card of martyrdom, a card a of prudence, a card of the Great Work, a card of duty [...] I will say very simply on my own part that it expresses the relation, in one of its aspects, between the Divine and the Universe.
The Hanged Man's symbolism points to divinity, linking it to the Passion in Christianity, especially The Crucifixion; to the narratives of Osiris in Egyptian mythology, and Mithras in Ancient Persian mythology and Roman mythology. In all of these archetypal stories, the destruction of self brings life to humanity; on the card, these are symbolized respectively by the person of the hanged man and the living tree from which he hangs bound.

The Hanged Man is also associated with Odin, the primary god in Norse mythology. Odin hung upside down from the world-tree, Yggdrasil, for nine days to attain wisdom and thereby retrieved the runes from the Well of Wyrd, which in Norse cosmology is regarded as the source and end of all sacred mystery and knowledge. The moment he glimpsed the runes, he died, but the knowledge of them was so powerful that he immediately returned to life.

Represents the sacrifices Blackjack must make on her journey. The connection to the crucifixion is especially portent.

-The moon overlooked by a black alicorn - Psalm/Lacunae and her doomed faith.

The Moon, watched by Nightmare Moon

wikipedia wrote:This card has to do with sleep patterns. This can mean both dreaming and nightmares. If one gets this card, one may be going through a particularly
difficult emotional time. Rather than losing yourself in the overwhelming imagery and fantasy that signal the presence of the Moon, give form to this imagery through the creative arts (painting, writing, or dancing). The association this card bears with imagery and fantasy can put one in touch with visions and insight, creativity and psychic powers.^[1]
The Moon can be interpreted with the feeling of uncertainty, where the past still haunts, unsure of a journey but still going ahead with it, feeling watched and because it is commonly associated with dreams, fantasies and mysteries this card can also be interpreted with surreal feelings and situations in your waking life

Probably heralds the emotional and, later, sleeping problems that Blackjack will develop over the course of her journey. Also, note that this is the second card that is connected with nightmares.

-A handsome stallion - Goldenblood.

This one's tough. It could either be the Magician, representing BJ's attempts to control her situation

Magician wrote:Some frequent keywords are:

• Action — Consciousness — Concentration — Personal power
  

• Practicality — Energy — Creativity — Movement
  

• Precision — Conviction — Manipulation — Self confidence
  

• Being objective — Focusing — Determination — Initiative
  

The Emporer, trying to tell her she may not be able to change the wasteland

The Emporer wrote:

The Emperor symbolizes the desire to rule over one's surroundings,
and its appearance in a reading often suggests that the subject needs to
accept that some things may not be controllable, and others may not
benefit from being controlled.

As with all Tarot
cards, multiple meanings are possible. Where the Empress is the
Feminine principle, the Emperor is the Masculine. Most individuals will
relate to this card in the same way they relate to their own father.

The Hierophant/High Priest, representing either those who want the status quo, or those who wish to challenge it

The Hierophant wrote:
Summary of Meanings:

When the card is upright: A person or situation involving
conservatism, conformity, and honoring traditional values. This could be
someone who's a teacher, instructor, religious leader, prophet, or a
group or community leader of some kind.

The Hierophant can also be someone who's a "go between" or
intermediary of some kind, who's able to interact with and channel use
of powerful and unseen forces, unavailable or inaccessible to the
masses. He does so for the benefit of the community he serves. This can
be someone who has access to, or influence and power within a number of
different domains.

When the card is reversed: A person or situation involving
radicalism, non conformity, rebellion, heresy, iconoclasm or demagogery;
and those who embody these things. The reversed Hierophant can
represent a leader of a radical group of some kind, a promoter and
defender of some radical ideology.

It can represent people who may be demagogues, cult leaders, or false
prophets. The reversed Hierophant can be any "false teacher", one who
doesn't have mastery of the subject he or she teaches,and doesn't know
what he or she is talking about; though, thinks he or she does, because
of his or her ignorance or misperception. This can refer to one who is
just a bad teacher, or one who regularly gives bad advice, bad counsel
or bad guidance to others. (A person who thinks they know what they are
talking about, but in reality does not.)

or the Devil, representing BJ's belief that she can fix everything

The Devil wrote:The Devil is the card of self-bondage to an idea or belief which is
preventing a person from growing or being healthy—an example might be a
belief that getting drunk each night is good for you. On the other hand,
however, it can also be a warning to someone who is too restrained
and/or dispassionate and never allows him or herself to be rash or wild
or ambitious, which is yet another form of enslavement.

-The black towers of Hoofington wreathed in green light - The horrors of Hoofington.

The Tower, a card of ruin and despair (subtle)

Some frequent keywords used by card readers are:

• Chaos ----- Sudden change ----- Impact ----- Hard times
  

• Crisis ----- Revelation ----- Disruption ----- Realizing the truth
  

• Disillusion ----- Crash ----- Burst ----- Uncomfortable experience
  

• Downfall ----- Ruin ----- Ego blow ----- Explosive transformation
  

Upside down :

• To be currently in a harsh and chaotic situation but exiting in a good manner. Indeed you are falling but landing with your feet over the soil.
  

• The same of the normal position but less negative because their incorrect position can block some powers of the card.
  

-Six swords piercing the clouds - Likely symbolises the Ministry Mares dooming Equestria/the exodus of the Pegasi.

Six of swords. Pretty self explanatory:

The Boatman. A dangerous journey. Readers do not always agree on the
alignment of this card. It can indicate a doomed endeavour, or
conversely, moving out of troubled waters. It also indicates
responsibility for others.

-A yellow pegasus in front of a pool hugging a blue/grass ball - Fluttershy and the tragedy of her relationship with Goldenblood and her daughter.

The world

The World represents an ending to a cycle of life, a pause in life before the next big cycle beginning with the fool.^[4] The figure is at once male and female,
above and below, suspended between the heavens and the earth. It is
completeness. It is also said to represent cosmic consciousness; the
potential of perfect union with the One Power of the universe.^[5] It tells us full happiness is also to give back to the world, sharing what we have learned or gained

Pretty self-explanatory: the end of Blackjack, Security Mare of 99 and the beginning of Blackjack, Security Mare of Hoofington. Also tells us that the dealer knows that BJ has to go on this journey if she is to find true happiness.


Those are just my thoughts. What are yours?[/quote]



Also, hello.

That's one hell of a first post there Technowolf. Glad to have you in the forums!

@ Technowolf : upvoted for relevance. :D

Technowolf wrote:

-A pair of eyes eyes peeking out of a cage made of nine swords - Kind of vague this one, but I'd say something to do with the Marauders (since there are nine members) and the red eyes symbolise the monsters that most of them will become.

The 9 of swords. In occult tarot, swords represent nobility, military, and reason and are associated with air (pegasi?)

Wiki wrote:Terror, the Nightmare. Tarot readers do not generally like to categorise cards as "bad", or "good" but The Nine of Swords is probably the most dreaded card in the deck, however it can indicate the process of letting go, grief, and in combination with healing cards like The Queen of Wands, it is highly beneficial.

So maybe it represents Blackjack finally letting go of her stable?

"Only monsters can be truly happy in the wasteland..."

@Technowolf:
Welcome!

Lots of new folks! Hello, new folks, and welcome!

@Swicked
I dunno much about tarot, but can't you do a reading for someone else? That's how I've seen it in the movies, anyway - like in Brain Dead.

Wow, that was an amazing response TechnoWolf!

How do you Brohoof someone?

Evilgidgit wrote:Wow, that was an amazing response TechnoWolf!

How do you Brohoof someone?

On a persons post, next to the name there should be a + and -.

Obviously the + is an upvote, but there have been a share of downvotes from time to time.

Technowolf wrote:They're Tarot cards. Here's a basic rundown from Wikipedia:

We should probably be calling you Tarotwolf now.

Technowolf wrote:

The Hanged Man is also associated with Odin, the primary god in Norse mythology. Odin hung upside down from the world-tree, Yggdrasil, for nine days to attain wisdom and thereby retrieved the runes from the Well of Wyrd, which in Norse cosmology is regarded as the source and end of all sacred mystery and knowledge. The moment he glimpsed the runes, he died, but the knowledge of them was so powerful that he immediately returned to life.

Represents the sacrifices Blackjack must make on her journey. The connection to the crucifixion is especially portent.

I'm not sure about that. As I understand it, the Hanged Mare is also about passivity and letting go of things. In that aspect, it seems to apply strongly to BJ -- giving up the guilt and the need to push herself past the limit, learning to think before she acts, etc.

Technowolf wrote:

-A handsome stallion - Goldenblood.

This one's tough. It could either be the Magician, representing BJ's attempts to control her situation
The Emporer, trying to tell her she may not be able to change the wasteland
The Hierophant/High Priest, representing either those who want the status quo, or those who wish to challenge it
or the Devil, representing BJ's belief that she can fix everything

I think I'm leaning toward the Hierophant. The card has a golden crown that fits in with Goldie's appearance, and the way he worked for the status quo and Luna's rule in spite of his own misgivings seems to me like a warning that BJ has the capacity to do great harm simply by doing nothing.

Technowolf wrote:Also, hello.

Hi!

Evilgidgit wrote:Wow, that was an amazing response TechnoWolf!

How do you Brohoof someone?

Click the little + between the user information column and the post text. Though I seem to recall that there might be a minimum post threshold before the option is unlocked.
edit: And once again I fail to notice a new page.

O. Hinds wrote:

Evilgidgit wrote:Wow, that was an amazing response TechnoWolf!

How do you Brohoof someone?

Click the little + between the user information column and the post text. Though I seem to recall that there might be a minimum post threshold before the option is unlocked.
edit: And once again I fail to notice a new page.

You need to make ten posts first before you can use the silly brohoof system.

SilentCarto wrote:

Technowolf wrote:They're Tarot cards. Here's a basic rundown from Wikipedia:

We should probably be calling you Tarotwolf now.

All I did was go to Wikipedia and copy-paste stuff here. the only reason I recognized them was the swords/cups. I seem to recall another tarot or tarot-type scene in another chapter. If someone could be so kind as to post the chapter #, I could do a brief rundown of those as well.

SilentCarto wrote:

Technowolf wrote:

The Hanged Man is also associated with Odin, the primary god in Norse mythology. Odin hung upside down from the world-tree, Yggdrasil, for nine days to attain wisdom and thereby retrieved the runes from the Well of Wyrd, which in Norse cosmology is regarded as the source and end of all sacred mystery and knowledge. The moment he glimpsed the runes, he died, but the knowledge of them was so powerful that he immediately returned to life.

Represents the sacrifices Blackjack must make on her journey. The connection to the crucifixion is especially portent.

I'm not sure about that. As I understand it, the Hanged Mare is also about passivity and letting go of things. In that aspect, it seems to apply strongly to BJ -- giving up the guilt and the need to push herself past the limit, learning to think before she acts, etc.

Remember, there are probably as many ways to interpret tarot cards as there are people who interpret them, if not more. It could just be foreshadowing her dangling from the beam in Flash Industries - i.e. she is a literal Hanged Mare. Or it could be that she'll eventually need to cut her head off and send it floating to get the only damn key that spawned in the level to open the last damn treasure room before Mom, only to find its the fucking bean AND I ALREADY HAVE A PERFECTLY GOOD ITEM GAME BUT I HAVEN'T GOTTEN ANY DAMN HEALTH OR ATTACK POWER-UPS SINCE MONSTRO WHY DO YOU HATE ME ISAAC? (can you tell what game I've been playing lately?)

SilentCarto wrote:

Technowolf wrote:

-A handsome stallion - Goldenblood.

This one's tough. It could either be the Magician, representing BJ's attempts to control her situation
The Emporer, trying to tell her she may not be able to change the wasteland
The Hierophant/High Priest, representing either those who want the status quo, or those who wish to challenge it
or the Devil, representing BJ's belief that she can fix everything

I think I'm leaning toward the Hierophant. The card has a golden crown that fits in with Goldie's appearance, and the way he worked for the status quo and Luna's rule in spite of his own misgivings seems to me like a warning that BJ has the capacity to do great harm simply by doing nothing.

It also fits with his friendship with Luna. The Hierophant is also known as the Pope, that is, the only human to be close to God.



Also, a small preview of my next effortpost:
Blackjack Christ, Blackjack Christ,
Who are you? what have you sacrificed?
Blackjack Christ, Superstar!
Do you think you're what they say you are?

SilentCarto wrote:So...
Does Boo have a 200-year-old Fluffle Puff plushie, or does Fluffle Puff have a brand-new Boo action figure?

Okay, you just made me imagine Fluffle Puff staring into a Fallout Equestria snowglobe.

SilentCarto wrote:

-A handsome stallion - Goldenblood.

I think I'm leaning toward the Hierophant. The card has a golden crown that fits in with Goldie's appearance, and the way he worked for the status quo and Luna's rule in spite of his own misgivings seems to me like a warning that BJ has the capacity to do great harm simply by doing nothing.

"A handsome unicorn buck smiling, his mane and horn bright yellow"
The yellow horn and mane are clearly representing a crown, but that could be either the Emperor or the Heirophant. Which quite honestly are so similar they might as well be the same card; both represent power and authority, tradition, and so on. While the Emperor has more of a 'fatherhood' tilt, the Heirophant is about education and knowledge, as well as deception. Which doesn't really help any 'cause both of those apply to Goldie. I suspect it's the Heirophant, though.

The living tombstone just released this song-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMronwfcmFc

cb5 wrote:The living tombstone just released this song-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMronwfcmFc

WHOA!


holy shit, Somber you've got a song!


whoa

Technowolf wrote:Also, hello.

More new meat!

As per tradition you get a first post gift, pick one: a shotgun, a bottle of whiskey, or infinite sanity (don't pick the sanity, you'll miss out on so many fun times)

I picked the Rum

Admiral Stoic Rum wrote:

cb5 wrote:The living tombstone just released this song-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMronwfcmFc

WHOA!


holy shit, Somber you've got a song!


whoa

And by the living tombstone also.

i know, but that is not important! what is important is would tombstone choose a shotgun, whiskey or infinite sanity?

Embedded because awesome.

cb5 wrote:The living tombstone just released this song-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMronwfcmFc

O.O

One of us may secretly be Tombstone, that explains the outofnowhereness. Reveal yourself so I can say that I effectively trolled or unfoundedly criticized a minor Internet thuperstar!

cb5 wrote:The living tombstone just released this song-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMronwfcmFc

Holy shit
Holy shit
It says the song is on Bandcamp
IT LIES

Well, what more can one say to that except 'Awesome!'? Because it is.

Blackjack has a theme song!

Oh, and I picked the sanity, so I can turn it into insanity!

I pick the Elder Sign, so next time a gate opens I can dive right in, auto-seal it and remove a doom token to slow the awakening of the old one.

cb5 wrote:The living tombstone just released this song-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMronwfcmFc

For information, it's part of this album :

http://balloonparty.bandcamp.com/album/fours-fall-down

I can imagine this song being this fic's anime opening or a boss theme in a fan-game. Very fitting to the character I must say.

Darkbright39 wrote:I can imagine this song being this fic's anime opening or a boss theme in a fan-game. Very fitting to the character I must say.

It would be fitting for hightower or the deus fight.