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[GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by O. Hinds on Tue Aug 07, 2012 1:17 am

Erumpet wrote:@Himds: your train is getting scarier by the post
Thank you. The psychological impact was another thing I was trying to achieve. Hopefully the next update will continue the trend.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by swicked on Tue Aug 07, 2012 1:33 am

O. Hinds wrote:Oh, by the way, I think that I'll use a Janney coupler for its load capacity and potential political reasons precluding the use of some fully automatic coupler design. That sound good?
This was the one that got me giggling inconsolably about the entire discussion. It's just so amazing XD

I'm sure there's a completely legitimate political fanon reason for why it would be politically correct to use a particular coupler on our my little pony (not even fallout: equestria) cartoon train... but I'll have none of it XD

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Overlong Analysis Cobalt on Tue Aug 07, 2012 1:48 am

Erumpet wrote:Unrelated rant about MLP FiM
Spoiler:
Just watched the Super Speedey Cider Squeezey 6000 episode again, and I have to admit I still believe that the apple family where the bad guys. I mean, the machine works, the cider is good, and the Flim Flam brothers opened non hostile business negotiations. Sure the initial offer wasn't favorable, but you always make your first offer unacceptable, so you can negotiate to a fair deal. I think the apple family was close minded, arrogant, and only won by cheating and forcing the brothers hooves. To be honest though, I just love the Flim Flam brothers and blame the apples for running them out of town. Grumble gripe grumble
Spoiler:
I dunno, I mean, they agreed that it was fair play to have other ponies help. If that wasn't okay, then goading the Apple family into a contest for the sole right to selling cider wasn't, either - heck, that was worse, even, 'cos Flim and Flam knew damn well that they'd win without question, whereas the Apples did not. Both sides got tricked because of their hubris; one made up for it by hiring more workers, one made up for it by cutting quality. And it's not like they offered different terms, either; they gave an offer, the Apples said "eenope," and the Flim Flam Bros. said, "Okay, then we're in competition." That's not unethical, but neither are they really negotiating. That said, I do like Flim and Flam for their songs and voice acting and spontaneous dancing.

Regarding Fallout, btw, has anyone else tried out making it so that NPCs use ammo? I'm playing around with it, and it seems functional so far; the only issue is that it makes sneaking even more OP, 'cos the best way to get ammo is to kill an enemy before it can fire a shot. But since I'm already working with realism-based nerfs to sneak, hopefully it'll balance out.

Also, Fallout 3's repair system is really, really bad. The best thing about New Vegas, I have decided, is multiple ammo types followed by the repair system. FO3's repair is worthless until it's at a high level; New Vegas' is mostly just good for the fantastic perks and the bulletsmithing, but it's still better.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Admiral Stoic Rum on Tue Aug 07, 2012 1:52 am

AHEM! Attention everyone if I could have your attention please.





Dat plot.

That is all
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by RoboRed on Tue Aug 07, 2012 2:19 am


------------------
Aonee wrote:
jacky2734 wrote:((Aonee, don't make me invent a way to punch you over the internet.))
((If you do, I will invent a Korean technique to block it with someone else's face. And, construct more pylons.))

CamoBadger wrote:((Wow, zebra incest is powerful shit))

Mister Frost's friend, "Darren" wrote:"I'm scared to break up with her, though. Her dad's an ex-marine; if I make her cry he'll club me over the head with a pillowcase full of doorknobs and Tom Clancy novels."

Sindri wrote:This is a thread for fans of a fanfiction of a fanfiction about murderous miniature pastel equines in a grimdark post-apocalyptic future.
If you wanted to stay anywhere near socially acceptable, you should have taken a left turn about three layers of WTF back.

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by O. Hinds on Tue Aug 07, 2012 2:24 am

Overlong Analysis Cobalt wrote:Regarding Fallout, btw, has anyone else tried out making it so that NPCs use ammo? I'm playing around with it, and it seems functional so far; the only issue is that it makes sneaking even more OP, 'cos the best way to get ammo is to kill an enemy before it can fire a shot. But since I'm already working with realism-based nerfs to sneak, hopefully it'll balance out.
NPCs use ammunition in the first two games. They can even run out and have to run over and punch you.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Sindri on Tue Aug 07, 2012 2:25 am

Erumpet wrote:Unrelated rant about MLP FiM...
Going to have to disagree, to a point. The machine works, but the FlimFlams gave the distinct impression of not knowing how it did so or more than the basics of its operation, so they shouldn't get the credit for that. They showed callous disregard for the property of others on multiple occasions, conned the Apples into a bad deal, bullrushed from the agreed-upon exclusive rights to sell cider in town to tearing the Apple family's ancestral home out from under them and taking unlawful possession of the entire orchard... Meanwhile yes the Apple family was reluctant to accept new technology, but they were willing to give it a shot until the offer was not just unreasonable but insulting. At which point they sacrificed their apples (and trees, and fertile soil) for the sake of a fair competition and honestly outperformed the machine until the FlimFlams broke down and sabatoged themselves.

Of course the Apple family was clearly holding back supply to keep demand up before the brothers came into town; they "best they could do" on their own was just enough of keep people coming, and they demonstrated they could make enough for the entire town in an hour if pushed. And whoever did develop that machine ought to be selling it to people a fair shade better than the Flim Flam Brothers and making bits by the chestful; it made high quality cider rapidly and all but effortlessly until those idiots screwed it up.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by O. Hinds on Tue Aug 07, 2012 2:26 am

swicked wrote:
O. Hinds wrote:Oh, by the way, I think that I'll use a Janney coupler for its load capacity and potential political reasons precluding the use of some fully automatic coupler design. That sound good?
This was the one that got me giggling inconsolably about the entire discussion. It's just so amazing XD

I'm sure there's a completely legitimate political fanon reason for why it would be politically correct to use a particular coupler on our my little pony (not even fallout: equestria) cartoon train... but I'll have none of it XD
Oh, no, this is for FoE. Sadly, I've not been able to identify the coupler used on the show.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Guest on Tue Aug 07, 2012 3:42 am

RoboRed wrote:
mmm I love to wake up in morning with some warm plot :D

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by O. Hinds on Tue Aug 07, 2012 3:44 am

Appropriate Sound (Not Counting Wind Noise)
And I believe that the unpainted model is finished (unless I or anyone here see a problem, or something)!
width: 3.2m
length: 20.42m
height: 5.05m
Pictures:









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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Overlong Analysis Cobalt on Tue Aug 07, 2012 3:55 am

O. Hinds wrote:
Overlong Analysis Cobalt wrote:Regarding Fallout, btw, has anyone else tried out making it so that NPCs use ammo? I'm playing around with it, and it seems functional so far; the only issue is that it makes sneaking even more OP, 'cos the best way to get ammo is to kill an enemy before it can fire a shot. But since I'm already working with realism-based nerfs to sneak, hopefully it'll balance out.
NPCs use ammunition in the first two games. They can even run out and have to run over and punch you.
Ooh, nice. I do miss things like that, even if they can really mess up a game's balance in this day and age. Anyway, after an hour or two, the only issues I've run into are:

A) NPC combat AI apparently, on occasion, tells them that using a breadknife is a better idea than a 14mm pistol, because they're more "skilled" with the knife. This wouldn't be as much of an issue if I hadn't given all the NPCs mediocre melee weaponry so they wouldn't charge with their fists after running out of bullets. Because that's just silly-looking.
B) I somehow managed to break the ironsights mod for the Colt 1911. (That might have been broken before, actually)
C) The NPCs' scrambles to find a new gun sometimes doesn't work well ("Oh no, out of ammo! Better grab that .32 revolver with one shot that's fifty yards away across an open field!" *dies horribly*).
D) Some of the ammo quantity balance needs work (NPCs armed with hunting rifles almost always have 20-30 bullets left over, which is way too much of a revenue/killing power source early game).
E) Since the combat AI was designed around infinite NPC ammo, they are happy to waste their 2-3 magazines when you're well out of range or behind cover.

HOWEVER! I watched some VERY cool BoS vs. super mutant fights. The minigunners rarely run out (I gave them enough ammo to last them a while), but the standard footsoldiers are swapping between their default laser rifles and the auto-shotguns that the super mutants tend to pack on the fly. Also, there's a definite sort of immersion to forcing raiders to come at you with shovels by ducking all their bullets. It's unfair, but fun.

If I could find a way to give NPCs their own non-usable-by-player ammo supplies, that'd fix things, but I'm not sure that's possible on the FO3 engine. In New Vegas, it'd be easy enough, I know that, but they've got the multiple ammo types coded in.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Rafafidi on Tue Aug 07, 2012 8:23 am

O. Hinds wrote:...Big Black Train...
Your train still lacks a large calliber weapon to clear the tracks of obstacles, like a boulder in the way.
I would suggest at least one more machinegun each side, because if one of these four become inoperative, you'll have a huge blind spot.
What are those big white spheres at the top?
(Great, you dragged me to your crazy train talk. Are you happy now?)
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by SilentCarto on Tue Aug 07, 2012 8:38 am

Erumpet wrote:Unrelated rant about MLP FiM
Spoiler:
Just watched the Super Speedey Cider Squeezey 6000 episode again, and I have to admit I still believe that the apple family where the bad guys. I mean, the machine works, the cider is good, and the Flim Flam brothers opened non hostile business negotiations. Sure the initial offer wasn't favorable, but you always make your first offer unacceptable, so you can negotiate to a fair deal. I think the apple family was close minded, arrogant, and only won by cheating and forcing the brothers hooves. To be honest though, I just love the Flim Flam brothers and blame the apples for running them out of town. Grumble gripe grumble
Not at all. The Apples simply demonstrated that the machine had no ability to scale up to meet demand. I'll agree, though, that instead of a contest, the Apples should have told them to take a walk and buy their supplies elsewhere. Sweet Apple Acres' cidering process isn't anything special; their cider is awesome because of the quality of their apples. If Flim and Flam had to buy their raw materials from another farm, they would be completely unable to compete in the quality department. The Apples definitely have something special if ponies are willing to line up hours ahead for just one mug, and it's not unfair for them to keep their production in-house and under their own control.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Icy Shake on Tue Aug 07, 2012 9:42 am

Sindri wrote:
Erumpet wrote:Unrelated rant about MLP FiM...
Going to have to disagree, to a point. The machine works, but the FlimFlams gave the distinct impression of not knowing how it did so or more than the basics of its operation, so they shouldn't get the credit for that. They showed callous disregard for the property of others on multiple occasions, conned the Apples into a bad deal, bullrushed from the agreed-upon exclusive rights to sell cider in town to tearing the Apple family's ancestral home out from under them and taking unlawful possession of the entire orchard... Meanwhile yes the Apple family was reluctant to accept new technology, but they were willing to give it a shot until the offer was not just unreasonable but insulting. At which point they sacrificed their apples (and trees, and fertile soil) for the sake of a fair competition and honestly outperformed the machine until the FlimFlams broke down and sabatoged themselves.

Of course the Apple family was clearly holding back supply to keep demand up before the brothers came into town; they "best they could do" on their own was just enough of keep people coming, and they demonstrated they could make enough for the entire town in an hour if pushed. And whoever did develop that machine ought to be selling it to people a fair shade better than the Flim Flam Brothers and making bits by the chestful; it made high quality cider rapidly and all but effortlessly until those idiots screwed it up.

So, I was always a little confused on the issue of the cider selling monopoly; did the Apples have one to start with? If so, why was it issued; if not, why didn't the Flim-Flams just buy other apples sold in town and produce that way, or import? Then we do get to the damages for the poor harvesting practices, and the fact that the competition was never about the ownership of the farm, but the cider monopoly.

On a semi-related note, how is it that the Apples are always on the edge of destitution or ruin, yet appear to be major landowners with no external labor costs and robust sales?

SilentCarto wrote:
Erumpet wrote:Unrelated rant about MLP FiM
Spoiler:
Just watched the Super Speedey Cider Squeezey 6000 episode again, and I have to admit I still believe that the apple family where the bad guys. I mean, the machine works, the cider is good, and the Flim Flam brothers opened non hostile business negotiations. Sure the initial offer wasn't favorable, but you always make your first offer unacceptable, so you can negotiate to a fair deal. I think the apple family was close minded, arrogant, and only won by cheating and forcing the brothers hooves. To be honest though, I just love the Flim Flam brothers and blame the apples for running them out of town. Grumble gripe grumble
Not at all. The Apples simply demonstrated that the machine had no ability to scale up to meet demand. I'll agree, though, that instead of a contest, the Apples should have told them to take a walk and buy their supplies elsewhere. Sweet Apple Acres' cidering process isn't anything special; their cider is awesome because of the quality of their apples. If Flim and Flam had to buy their raw materials from another farm, they would be completely unable to compete in the quality department. The Apples definitely have something special if ponies are willing to line up hours ahead for just one mug, and it's not unfair for them to keep their production in-house and under their own control.

Eh, I largely agree with you here, but I just can't help but think that using monopoly power to prevent new entrance to the market is bad overall. It would be one thing if they just sold cider, but since they sell apples at retail (and frankly have to sell at wholesale as well, given their output), refusing to sell to potential cider competitors (especially if you barred other customers from reselling to them) would be, to my mind, inappropriate anitcompetitive practices. I guess they could just stop selling apples during cider season, but I get the feeling that cider season is such just because it's when the Apples decide to go into brewing mode.

Frankly, nobody in the episode came out looking very good, and the better way to handle it would have been to say "We won't go into business with you, but here's a price schedule. Buy some apples!"
And then cider supply is more than doubled and each factor of production is adequately compensated.

Also, announcing quantities produced and, if continuing to under produce, limiting per-customer orders. Or just raising prices. Really, I can't believe that the Apples didn't figure out that out, given their oft-stated financial difficulties.

Re: models. Those look amazing.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by swicked on Tue Aug 07, 2012 10:34 am

O. Hinds wrote:
swicked wrote:
O. Hinds wrote:Oh, by the way, I think that I'll use a Janney coupler for its load capacity and potential political reasons precluding the use of some fully automatic coupler design. That sound good?
This was the one that got me giggling inconsolably about the entire discussion. It's just so amazing XD

I'm sure there's a completely legitimate political fanon reason for why it would be politically correct to use a particular coupler on our my little pony (not even fallout: equestria) cartoon train... but I'll have none of it XD
Oh, no, this is for FoE. Sadly, I've not been able to identify the coupler used on the show.
...really? But all your measurements and calculations have been based on screen captures, and isn't the war supposed to be at least ten years after the show?
How are you altering your designs to accommodate changes in... I dunno, I guess technology, the fact that trains are no longer horse-aided (or are they?), most trains likely more cargo and less passenger... Eh. You've probably already covered all this and I just wasn't paying close enough attention XD

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Kattlarv on Tue Aug 07, 2012 10:43 am

@Kipper: I kinda crashed randomly from the start of the vault up till... first town, derp, to the school, to the market, to the minefield. Think I crashed 9 times in a house with cockroaches in minefield.

@Robo: Text and pictures, everywhere xD

@Scyto: Ah, Fallout 2, the game, if I recall right, where you were 80 % certain to die if you did not have a good enough Str/End/Agi score and tagged either melee or unarmed xP Liked the homage to Fo1 in it though. And the game overall. Was kinda fun you could get a powerarmour about the first you did.

@EP: (Flim flam) If I recall, their cider wasn't as good, but it was good. And compare it being "slightly less good" as to having "way much more of it". One could say they'd prefer quantity over quality. Though, overall: They seemed to only have x amount of apples to make cider out of anyhow, going with how most would need to be used for storage for winter and etc. I'd reckon. So I'd either be higher quality over a longer time, or slightly lower quality, but much more at one go over a short time.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Ketchup on Tue Aug 07, 2012 10:51 am

Well, time to break out Fallout 1 again...
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Sindri on Tue Aug 07, 2012 10:53 am

Incidentally, the old Fallout games are now on Steam. Base price is $10 each but for the next two hours they're 2/3 off or you can get both and that "Tactics" thing all for 6.79
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Ketchup on Tue Aug 07, 2012 11:00 am

The Quakecon sale. Yeah. Err, no. Just a daily sale.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Erumpet on Tue Aug 07, 2012 11:36 am

@Flim & Flam: I may have been a bit harsh on the apples and a bit too lenient with Dlim & Flam, but I still believe that the Apples abused a monopoly, and that the brothers opened business negotiations before becoming competitors. They made an offer, and the Apples should have counter offered at a more reasonable rate. That's how these things work. If the apples were insulted, then they are letting emotion get in the way of business and practicality. Also, at one point the Apples stole and destroyed cider produced by the brothers, because it was produced with apple family apples that had been freely given to the brothers. That should be illegal. Admittedly, the brothers did let the family get help in the competition so I can't really say the family cheated. On the other hoof, if the Apples business is so precarious it depends on cider season, they are in no position to have a cider selling rights contest, which further leads me to believe that they are a bad business which only stays afloat due to its monopoly of the apple market. Finally, I am totally biased because of how wicked awesome cool I think the Flim Flam brothers are, and would defend their honor to the death against any of you scallywags Roid Rage
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Ketchup on Tue Aug 07, 2012 11:53 am

That was a short venture. I had 1 hp left and I had just killed the radscorpions. I was poisoned, so I went to Razlo to get some antidote. He's supposed to heal you while he makes it, so I wasn't worried. I died from the damned poison while time compressed.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by FeatherDust on Tue Aug 07, 2012 1:17 pm

Sindri wrote:This means that, given the right pedigree and a little luck, an earth pony can give birth to a pegasus or a unicorn, or both as we saw with the Cakes. It also means that with a relatively simple and common mutation, say one instance in 100,000 or 10,000,000 births, that pair of simple genetic on/off switches might not work right. You might get a unicorn with some traits displayed from their pegasus code, or an earth pony with a nubby little horn.


In my mind, until evidence to the contrary or a more likely theory is presented, Cadence is a unicorn with partial display of pegasus genes.

However, true Alicorns are something beyond this simple genetic system, possibly a much rarer and more pervasive mutation but more likely something truly divine
I'd hold all Cadence theories until s3's Crystal Ponies story is told, since apparently Cadence is their princess or something. She may actually be semi-immortal or some such thing.

On the Cakes: they are not a reliable source of information. Mr. Cake was clearly being dishonest with tha story about relatives, and anyway the pegasus was not blood related if you work through it.

I take the Occam's Razor view: the simplest explanation is likely correct. The simplest explanation here is that Mr. Cake isn't the twins' father. Doesn't necessarily imply infidelity per se - my headcanon is Mr Cake is infertile and they had to find a surrogate father. Or two. Little party going on there, maybe. He would still be embarrassed to admit that, thus the lies. (As fraternal twins, the kids could each have a different genetic father.) It's easier to swallow that than that one or both of the kids are one in a million mutants or recipients of unreasonably distant genetic code. Throwbacks can happen, but two throwbacks with different throwback phenotypes? That's not reasonable.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by swicked on Tue Aug 07, 2012 1:49 pm

[quote="FeatherDust"]
Sindri wrote:This means that, given the right pedigree and a little luck, an earth pony can give birth to a pegasus or a unicorn, or both as we saw with the Cakes. It also means that with a relatively simple and common mutation, say one instance in 100,000 or 10,000,000 births, that pair of simple genetic on/off switches might not work right. You might get a unicorn with some traits displayed from their pegasus code, or an earth pony with a nubby little horn.

If I am remember correctly, we already have two examples of this. Pinkie and Fluttershy.
Pinkie was going to be a pegasus. Somewhere along the line she turned into an earth pony, though. Despite this she still seems more comfortable in the air. She bounces everywhere and builds flying machines. She even occasionally just hangs in the air, though that is more likely due to the strange magic she has access to.
Fluttershy was thus turned into a pegasus. One that is afraid of flying and performs duties that I believe are otherwise intended for earth ponies.
So yeah... it's definitely possible to get some genes mixed up.

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Sindri on Tue Aug 07, 2012 2:28 pm

swicked wrote:If I am remember correctly, we already have two examples of this. Pinkie and Fluttershy.
Pinkie was going to be a pegasus. Somewhere along the line she turned into an earth pony, though. Despite this she still seems more comfortable in the air. She bounces everywhere and builds flying machines. She even occasionally just hangs in the air, though that is more likely due to the strange magic she has access to.
Fluttershy was thus turned into a pegasus. One that is afraid of flying and performs duties that I believe are otherwise intended for earth ponies.
So yeah... it's definitely possible to get some genes mixed up.
An argument could definitely be made for Fluttershy; she's a weak flyer and has the connection with the earth and animals that's much more common in earth ponies, so there's a possibility that she's a winged earth pony, but I think it's more probable that she's just weird. For analogy, there are a lot more people who are physically one sex and mentally the opposite gender than there are people with full or partial sets of both genitalia.

As for Pinkie... I dunno. She's either a psioic reality warper, or she's actually a half-dozen changelings pretending to be a single pony. Something as simple as this mutation can't explain a fifth of what she does.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Sindri on Tue Aug 07, 2012 2:28 pm

FeatherDust wrote:I take the Occam's Razor view: the simplest explanation is likely correct. The simplest explanation here is that Mr. Cake isn't the twins' father. Doesn't necessarily imply infidelity per se - my headcanon is Mr Cake is infertile and they had to find a surrogate father. Or two. Little party going on there, maybe. He would still be embarrassed to admit that, thus the lies. (As fraternal twins, the kids could each have a different genetic father.) It's easier to swallow that than that one or both of the kids are one in a million mutants or recipients of unreasonably distant genetic code. Throwbacks can happen, but two throwbacks with different throwback phenotypes? That's not reasonable.
Even if you're correct about him not being the father, for which there is absolutely no evidence, that's still a full-blooded unicorn and pegasus being born to an earth pony mother. And there doesn't need to be another stallion involved or any sort of mutation; if the triggers for the pegasus and unicorn dna are both recessive both parents could easily be heterozygous, giving every conception by them a 1/4 chance of being (unicorn or pegasus, depending on which takes precedence) and a 3/16 chance of being the other. Just like two brown-eyed humans can give birth to a blue-eyed child. His naming of relatives who were unicorns and pegasi isn't claiming that the children are direct descendants of those relatives, it's giving evidence for the Cakes likely being heterozygous instead of coming from lines which contained only earth ponies.



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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by FeatherDust on Tue Aug 07, 2012 5:05 pm

Sindri wrote:An argument could definitely be made for Fluttershy; she's a weak flyer and has the connection with the earth and animals that's much more common in earth ponies, so there's a possibility that she's a winged earth pony, but I think it's more probable that she's just weird.
Fluttershy never saw the ground before she was in flight school. Ergo, both her parents are pegasi.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by swicked on Tue Aug 07, 2012 5:15 pm

Sindri wrote:
swicked wrote:If I am remember correctly, we already have two examples of this. Pinkie and Fluttershy.
Pinkie was going to be a pegasus. Somewhere along the line she turned into an earth pony, though. Despite this she still seems more comfortable in the air. She bounces everywhere and builds flying machines. She even occasionally just hangs in the air, though that is more likely due to the strange magic she has access to.
Fluttershy was thus turned into a pegasus. One that is afraid of flying and performs duties that I believe are otherwise intended for earth ponies.
So yeah... it's definitely possible to get some genes mixed up.
An argument could definitely be made for Fluttershy; she's a weak flyer and has the connection with the earth and animals that's much more common in earth ponies, so there's a possibility that she's a winged earth pony, but I think it's more probable that she's just weird. For analogy, there are a lot more people who are physically one sex and mentally the opposite gender than there are people with full or partial sets of both genitalia.

As for Pinkie... I dunno. She's either a psioic reality warper, or she's actually a half-dozen changelings pretending to be a single pony. Something as simple as this mutation can't explain a fifth of what she does.

Sindri: *talks about how some ponies might genetically be one thing, but spiritually another*
Swicked: *agrees, offers two examples*
Sindri: Nah, they're just weird. Like hemaphrodites.
Swicked: 🍌

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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by FeatherDust on Tue Aug 07, 2012 5:27 pm

Sindri wrote:Even if you're correct about him not being the father, for which there is absolutely no evidence, that's still a full-blooded unicorn and pegasus being born to an earth pony mother.
Well, I hope my discussion of how very unlikely Cake's claim is, and his own obvious discomfort, will serve as evidence that he's not. Anyway I never claimed crossbreeds don't exist, so I'm not sure what this is meant to prove.
And there doesn't need to be another stallion involved or any sort of mutation; if the triggers for the pegasus and unicorn dna are both recessive both parents could easily be heterozygous, giving every conception by them a 1/4 chance of being (unicorn or pegasus, depending on which takes precedence) and a 3/16 chance of being the other.
Doesn't work. Try to write up an inheritance whereby both parents express earth pony but the kids are one of each other.

You can't. Suppose mr cake is half unicorn and mrs cake is half pegasus. Eu and Ep. The kids could be EE pure earth, Eu like dad, Ep like mom, or up and express as one of the two other breeds.

In any case, if they had any closer relatives to claim, Mr Cake would have. He fell back on a lame excuse, and that means there WERE no better ones.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Erumpet on Tue Aug 07, 2012 5:42 pm

@Featherdust: I agree that there was something fishy about Mr. Cake's answer, but I don't think we should jump to the conclusion there was another stallion involved, although that certainly seems most likely. I just think that this being a children's show about magic, there is probably an answer that does not involve Mrs. Cake getting knocked up by another stallion. Someone said maybe Mr. Cake is infertile, which I thought sounded likely, and so maybe he went through some magical or alchemical means to get Mrs. Cake pregnant. But to be sure, my initial reaction was "aw shit Mrs. Cake been sleeping around". It's just in the context of a children's show, that seems unlikely. Plus, for something as complicated as wings or a horn plus the associated magic, it's probably not a simple two allele dominant/recessive gene, so Sindris point does work.
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

Post by Icy Shake on Tue Aug 07, 2012 6:13 pm

Erumpet wrote:@Flim & Flam: I may have been a bit harsh on the apples and a bit too lenient with Dlim & Flam, but I still believe that the Apples abused a monopoly, and that the brothers opened business negotiations before becoming competitors. They made an offer, and the Apples should have counter offered at a more reasonable rate. That's how these things work. If the apples were insulted, then they are letting emotion get in the way of business and practicality. Also, at one point the Apples stole and destroyed cider produced by the brothers, because it was produced with apple family apples that had been freely given to the brothers. That should be illegal. Admittedly, the brothers did let the family get help in the competition so I can't really say the family cheated. On the other hoof, if the Apples business is so precarious it depends on cider season, they are in no position to have a cider selling rights contest, which further leads me to believe that they are a bad business which only stays afloat due to its monopoly of the apple market. Finally, I am totally biased because of how wicked awesome cool I think the Flim Flam brothers are, and would defend their honor to the death against any of you scallywags

I've already said my piece on the monopoly matters (on which I largely side with you), but I'd like to point out that if the cider that was confiscated was made from Apple family apples, it was not the full property of Flim and Flam; the apples were explicitly lent for demonstration purposes only.

FeatherDust wrote:On the Cakes: they are not a reliable source of information. Mr. Cake
was clearly being dishonest with tha story about relatives, and anyway
the pegasus was not blood related if you work through it.

I take the
Occam's Razor view: the simplest explanation is likely correct. The
simplest explanation here is that Mr. Cake isn't the twins' father.
Doesn't necessarily imply infidelity per se - my headcanon is Mr Cake
is infertile and they had to find a surrogate father. Or two. Little
party going on there, maybe. He would still be embarrassed to admit
that, thus the lies. (As fraternal twins, the kids could each have a
different genetic father.) It's easier to swallow that than that one or
both of the kids are one in a million mutants or recipients of
unreasonably distant genetic code. Throwbacks can happen, but two
throwbacks with different throwback phenotypes? That's not
reasonable.

I like that headcanon.

But Cup Cake's "great-aunt's second cousin twice removed" could be, but isn't necessarily, a blood relative (albeit oddly stated; if an actual blood relative, it would more concisely be stated as Cup Cake's fourth cousin [zero times removed] or fourth cousin four times removed [her great-great-great-aunt or -uncle], I think).
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Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

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